With over 750 million plays on Spotify at the time of writing, Katrina and the Waves' 'Walking on Sunshine' is among the biggest songs of the 1980s. Featuring the vocals and guitar of Katrina Leskanich, it's the perfect distillation of happiness. "It's an occasion song, so when the sun shines, or it's a party, it's a feel-good thing", says the singer as we sit down for a chat. Previewing her appearance at Rewind Festival in August, we caught up with the American-born, UK resident for a chat about the recording of the monster track, her unlikely connection to Ozzy Osbourne, and nostalgia for "ugly dad dancing". Back for the weekend; Eamon O'Neill.
Hi Katrina, how are you doing?
Hi, everything is really great. I mean, it's always great when the sun shines, but of course, I love the rain as well. I love the chaos of the weather, so I've definitely landed in the right place [England]. Every normal day is usually about a routine which usually is building up to a weekend show. We've got a show on Friday, and so everything starts looking like it's gearing up for that. The most important thing of course, is what sandwiches are we going to take on the road. Forget about the guitar and the amp; have you got the sandwiches!?
I was looking at your new video which we'll get to in this chat, and that's a really nice Telecaster you've got there.
Is that the pink one or the black one? The black one is kind of my spare. I've always liked the Telecasters because I've always tried to copy Chrissy Hynde and everything she's done, and it just sounds really good. I think it looks good, and I've got another pink one to match which has been in surgery for a little while, but it's back out there. I mean, my knowledge of guitars and amps and all that is just kind of, plug it in and it seems to be okay. In that respect. I'm very girlish because I'm not interested in conversations about amps or, you know, guitars; I really would rather talk about those sandwiches.
You're playing Rewind Festival this summer, and Rewind is always such a special celebration; what's it like for you to be going out and hitting those festivals?
Yeah, so the thing about Rewind is you can do it for a year, and then they'll rest you for a couple because somehow they already think everybody's sick to death of you. So I have been in rest mode, and they've brought me back out and dusted me off and wound me up; "get out there and do your thing! Do your 'Walking on Sunshine' thing and your 'Love Shine a Light' thing, whatever!" The great thing about the Rewind gigs is it's a guaranteed audience, and it's the kind of audience where they're up for the fun of it. If you follow on their website, the build up is incredible; "Is everybody ready? Has everybody got their Scooby Doo costumes?!", or their their Mario from whatever that game was in the '80s. So they come dressed as things which is a little bit of a phenomenon, because certainly in the '80s, I suppose it would look now as if everybody was dressing up, but it was just a normal clothes. But I promise you, nobody ever came to a gig of mine in the early '80s dressed as Scooby Doo,
That must have been disappointing for you.
Oh my god, I can't tell you, I'm just crushed! So now it's kind of more like Halloween. And I mean, they enter into the spirit of it, which is the most important thing. I think as the years go on, there are more chairs brought so people get the chair and they park up, because you're looking at people and they're like in their sixties and seventies now who are relating to '80s music. But I mean, the '80s just keep on giving; '80s music still crops up everywhere, and in commercials and in movies. It's because the melodies were so strong and the identity. A lot of music from the '80s is very strong, and somehow - even though there was a lot of strife, especially in this country connected with the '80s, with the miners strikes, and Margaret Thatcher and a lot of unrest - it's still for a lot of people, very much a golden period. It was before the phone, so you still have old photo albums, and all that nostalgic stuff before the cell phone came in and kind of ruined everything.
You find the cell phone culture irritating?
You know, I'll start singing 'Walking on Sunshine', and people aren't really dancing or clapping or waving their arms around and getting into it as they used to, or a lot of ugly dad dancing, as I used to call it; they're just holding up their phones. They're standing stock-still, and they're watching me through their phones, and I'm thinking; "but I'm right here!"
There are some songs that are quintessential '80s like 'Take On Me', and 'I Want to Know What Love Is', and 'Walking on Sunshine' is right up there. What's it like for you to be associated with a track like that?
Well, it's a very strange phenomenon. That song will just not go away, and it kind of keeps gaining momentum, somehow. I think it's just the effervescent freshness of the song, and the automatic feel-good when you hear those drums. I mean, like I said, nobody knows how to dance to it; it's the ugliest dancing I've ever seen, and after about two and a half minutes, most people aren't dancing and all; they're just sort of standing there, they're out of breath, or they're just thinking; "well, you know, I've done my bit, I've jumped up and down for a minute and a half. I've hit my maximum, I'm going to have a fucking heart attack!" So yeah, I mean, you know, we didn't really see that happening a hundred years ago when we recorded the song. I thought it was slightly irritating myself. But you know, it's a novelty song, and it's an occasion song, so when the sun shines, or it's a party, or it's a feel-good thing. I think in that way, it works like a lot of Beach Boys songs; [sings] "wouldn't it be nice if we...", you know? That kind of vibe.
The original version of the track from 1983 is slightly different to the 1985 hit version.
It was the rhythm horn section, The Rumour horn section. They were very, very famous at the time. They played on a lot of '80s records and when we were recording 'Walking on Sunshine', a guy called Eamon Fitzpatrick, well, he was wandering by - I think he was a tea boy in the Greenhouse, which is near Old Street Station in London - and he said; "you know you should put some horns on that", and we said; "oh, yeah, really? You think so?!" He said; "yeah, I'll write a part for you and give it to you tomorrow", and it was as simple as that, really. And he went [sings first horn part], and we thought, okay, fine, we'll get the Rumour section boys in, and they're all complaining; "oh, it's so hard to play", or; "our lips hurt!". I mean, nobody whinges like a horn section, let me tell you! These guys! "Really, your lips hurt?!"
What do you remember about the recording sessions?
It was originally recorded in London. When we got signed by Capitol Records, they took the recording that had been done for Attic Records [in 1983], a small Canadian label, and they said; "we're going to take this down to New York, to The Power Station, with the new kid on the block. His name is Scott Litt."
Scott Litt is quite well-know these days.
Scott Litt went on to do REM, Indigo Girls, Nirvana, but 'Walking on Sunshine' was his first hit. Scott was completely hyperactive. He had no fingernails; he chewed them down to absolute nubs. He had the air conditioning on minus thirty, and we walked into the studio and he said; "I thought I'd start with the drums", and we're blasted to the back wall because he's turned it up so loud, and all of a sudden the track's started with drums. He had got our drummer to record a little bit in the Power Station room where they record magnificent sounding drums, and then he just kind of looped it through.
So Scott changed the intro?
Our old version used to start with; "ow!", and then he decided; "we've got to put some drums on here, because DJs will talk over it, and they'll love it", and he was absolutely right, and kind of transformed our little recording, all the rest of the recording. He kept everything from the studio at the Greenhouse where we recorded with Pat Collier, who was the bass player in The Vibrators.
Hi, everything is really great. I mean, it's always great when the sun shines, but of course, I love the rain as well. I love the chaos of the weather, so I've definitely landed in the right place [England]. Every normal day is usually about a routine which usually is building up to a weekend show. We've got a show on Friday, and so everything starts looking like it's gearing up for that. The most important thing of course, is what sandwiches are we going to take on the road. Forget about the guitar and the amp; have you got the sandwiches!?
I was looking at your new video which we'll get to in this chat, and that's a really nice Telecaster you've got there.
Is that the pink one or the black one? The black one is kind of my spare. I've always liked the Telecasters because I've always tried to copy Chrissy Hynde and everything she's done, and it just sounds really good. I think it looks good, and I've got another pink one to match which has been in surgery for a little while, but it's back out there. I mean, my knowledge of guitars and amps and all that is just kind of, plug it in and it seems to be okay. In that respect. I'm very girlish because I'm not interested in conversations about amps or, you know, guitars; I really would rather talk about those sandwiches.
You're playing Rewind Festival this summer, and Rewind is always such a special celebration; what's it like for you to be going out and hitting those festivals?
Yeah, so the thing about Rewind is you can do it for a year, and then they'll rest you for a couple because somehow they already think everybody's sick to death of you. So I have been in rest mode, and they've brought me back out and dusted me off and wound me up; "get out there and do your thing! Do your 'Walking on Sunshine' thing and your 'Love Shine a Light' thing, whatever!" The great thing about the Rewind gigs is it's a guaranteed audience, and it's the kind of audience where they're up for the fun of it. If you follow on their website, the build up is incredible; "Is everybody ready? Has everybody got their Scooby Doo costumes?!", or their their Mario from whatever that game was in the '80s. So they come dressed as things which is a little bit of a phenomenon, because certainly in the '80s, I suppose it would look now as if everybody was dressing up, but it was just a normal clothes. But I promise you, nobody ever came to a gig of mine in the early '80s dressed as Scooby Doo,
That must have been disappointing for you.
Oh my god, I can't tell you, I'm just crushed! So now it's kind of more like Halloween. And I mean, they enter into the spirit of it, which is the most important thing. I think as the years go on, there are more chairs brought so people get the chair and they park up, because you're looking at people and they're like in their sixties and seventies now who are relating to '80s music. But I mean, the '80s just keep on giving; '80s music still crops up everywhere, and in commercials and in movies. It's because the melodies were so strong and the identity. A lot of music from the '80s is very strong, and somehow - even though there was a lot of strife, especially in this country connected with the '80s, with the miners strikes, and Margaret Thatcher and a lot of unrest - it's still for a lot of people, very much a golden period. It was before the phone, so you still have old photo albums, and all that nostalgic stuff before the cell phone came in and kind of ruined everything.
You find the cell phone culture irritating?
You know, I'll start singing 'Walking on Sunshine', and people aren't really dancing or clapping or waving their arms around and getting into it as they used to, or a lot of ugly dad dancing, as I used to call it; they're just holding up their phones. They're standing stock-still, and they're watching me through their phones, and I'm thinking; "but I'm right here!"
There are some songs that are quintessential '80s like 'Take On Me', and 'I Want to Know What Love Is', and 'Walking on Sunshine' is right up there. What's it like for you to be associated with a track like that?
Well, it's a very strange phenomenon. That song will just not go away, and it kind of keeps gaining momentum, somehow. I think it's just the effervescent freshness of the song, and the automatic feel-good when you hear those drums. I mean, like I said, nobody knows how to dance to it; it's the ugliest dancing I've ever seen, and after about two and a half minutes, most people aren't dancing and all; they're just sort of standing there, they're out of breath, or they're just thinking; "well, you know, I've done my bit, I've jumped up and down for a minute and a half. I've hit my maximum, I'm going to have a fucking heart attack!" So yeah, I mean, you know, we didn't really see that happening a hundred years ago when we recorded the song. I thought it was slightly irritating myself. But you know, it's a novelty song, and it's an occasion song, so when the sun shines, or it's a party, or it's a feel-good thing. I think in that way, it works like a lot of Beach Boys songs; [sings] "wouldn't it be nice if we...", you know? That kind of vibe.
The original version of the track from 1983 is slightly different to the 1985 hit version.
It was the rhythm horn section, The Rumour horn section. They were very, very famous at the time. They played on a lot of '80s records and when we were recording 'Walking on Sunshine', a guy called Eamon Fitzpatrick, well, he was wandering by - I think he was a tea boy in the Greenhouse, which is near Old Street Station in London - and he said; "you know you should put some horns on that", and we said; "oh, yeah, really? You think so?!" He said; "yeah, I'll write a part for you and give it to you tomorrow", and it was as simple as that, really. And he went [sings first horn part], and we thought, okay, fine, we'll get the Rumour section boys in, and they're all complaining; "oh, it's so hard to play", or; "our lips hurt!". I mean, nobody whinges like a horn section, let me tell you! These guys! "Really, your lips hurt?!"
What do you remember about the recording sessions?
It was originally recorded in London. When we got signed by Capitol Records, they took the recording that had been done for Attic Records [in 1983], a small Canadian label, and they said; "we're going to take this down to New York, to The Power Station, with the new kid on the block. His name is Scott Litt."
Scott Litt is quite well-know these days.
Scott Litt went on to do REM, Indigo Girls, Nirvana, but 'Walking on Sunshine' was his first hit. Scott was completely hyperactive. He had no fingernails; he chewed them down to absolute nubs. He had the air conditioning on minus thirty, and we walked into the studio and he said; "I thought I'd start with the drums", and we're blasted to the back wall because he's turned it up so loud, and all of a sudden the track's started with drums. He had got our drummer to record a little bit in the Power Station room where they record magnificent sounding drums, and then he just kind of looped it through.
So Scott changed the intro?
Our old version used to start with; "ow!", and then he decided; "we've got to put some drums on here, because DJs will talk over it, and they'll love it", and he was absolutely right, and kind of transformed our little recording, all the rest of the recording. He kept everything from the studio at the Greenhouse where we recorded with Pat Collier, who was the bass player in The Vibrators.
You've worked with some important names in music.
Yeah, we've always kind of been associated with really, really cool guys but have been extremely uncool ourselves! Like Eurovision, for example, you know, when we did the show at Eurovision in Dublin at The Point, May 3rd, 1997, with 'Love Shine a Light', there was a twenty-four piece orchestra which was conducted by our keyboard player at the time, who was no less than Don Airey, the keyboardist with the Deep Purple and Black Sabbath. He's this really cool guy, and he's conducting the orchestra and we have a shot of him at the very beginning; you know, it's his long hair, and he's kind of, like straight out of the '70s! We always felt like we needed to apologise to Don for bringing him down [laughing]! "If you thought you were cool, forget about it, you're conducting an orchestra for a song called 'Love Shine a Light' at Eurovision! Hello?!" You know, it's just strange.
He plays the keyboard intro on Ozzy Osbourne's 'Mr. Crowley', so from 'Mr. Crowley' to 'Love Shine a Light'; that is quite a spectrum, isn't it?
Sorry Don! We used to talk music. He's a very, very funny guy. He had all these '70s sensibilities like, he would never swap a seat with you because he's very, very superstitious, in that kind of old-fashioned way. Guys were always kind of saying; "oh, well, I'll take the early flight. I'll swap with you", and then of course the plane would crash.
I love the the simplicity of the guitar solo in 'Walking on Sunshine'; it's perfect for the song.
The daddle-addle-addle-a-dat-dat, that bit? [sings the riff at 2m 16s] Well, it's just a total rip off from [sings] "I need to love, love, to ease my mind" ['You Can't Hurry Love', by The Supremes]; that vibe, so it was just totally copied from that.
As I mentioned at the beginning, you've recently released a song and the video featuring your dog for 'I Couldn't Live Without Your Love'.
Look, who's a better star for a video? Who's better eye candy? You know, a 64 year old fat has-been, or a gorgeous little white poodle. I mean, I rest my case! And the song is very much about her. I mean, it's a gorgeous song, Tony Hatch and Jackie Trent wrote the song for Petula Clark back in the day, and I just absolutely love the song. It's so bright and feel-good and fun. It was so much fun to sing and do, and it took me probably two takes in the studio, and I was begging to do more because it's just so much fun to sing! When you get one of those songs, it's just glides off. It's so beautiful.
You must be looking forward to performing that live, if you haven't already.
Hello?! Give me a chance to learn the lyrics! I haven't performed it live yet. I mean, I don't know. My live set is kind of quite eclectic, because you go from some of the strange stuff I've written, from a song called 'Shut Your Mouth' and 'Crazy Mama', to 'Love Shine a Light' then 'Walking on Sunshine', then if I had, 'I Couldn't Live Without Your Love, well, why not? It'll probably happened this summer. Maybe not at the Rewind festivals, but at some point.
Is your time with The Waves behind you? Is that something in your past, or do you think you'll be getting back together at some point?
Well, we split up. I like to say The Waves crashed on the shore of life, and we did kind of separate in about 2000, so it's been a little while now that I've been with the new band. The guys were older than me, and I'm not sure if they still play, but I wouldn't say that a reunion is on the cards because we're not even really at the Christmas card stage. We just sort of parted ways, and that was it. It was really "move on".
What's coming up in your future?
Well, I've decided I'm just going to sporadically throw out singles from time to time, and I will continue on touring every weekend. Usually of a a summer there's plenty of work, and then of a winter I usually end up doing work in places like Australia and Dubai. So when I said about the song 'Walking on Sunshine' never going away, I meant it, because it seems like there's always room for it. People are always available to listen to it, and people are willing to book me on the strength of knowing that it's a song that's going to bring joy, bring people together, and make an occasion fun. It works really well for me because all I want to do, in the words of Cyndi Lauper, is have fun. You know, if it's not fun, I don't want to do it.
Katrina plays Rewind Scotland, Rewind North, and Rewind South this summer. For dates and info, visit the Rewind Festival site.
Yeah, we've always kind of been associated with really, really cool guys but have been extremely uncool ourselves! Like Eurovision, for example, you know, when we did the show at Eurovision in Dublin at The Point, May 3rd, 1997, with 'Love Shine a Light', there was a twenty-four piece orchestra which was conducted by our keyboard player at the time, who was no less than Don Airey, the keyboardist with the Deep Purple and Black Sabbath. He's this really cool guy, and he's conducting the orchestra and we have a shot of him at the very beginning; you know, it's his long hair, and he's kind of, like straight out of the '70s! We always felt like we needed to apologise to Don for bringing him down [laughing]! "If you thought you were cool, forget about it, you're conducting an orchestra for a song called 'Love Shine a Light' at Eurovision! Hello?!" You know, it's just strange.
He plays the keyboard intro on Ozzy Osbourne's 'Mr. Crowley', so from 'Mr. Crowley' to 'Love Shine a Light'; that is quite a spectrum, isn't it?
Sorry Don! We used to talk music. He's a very, very funny guy. He had all these '70s sensibilities like, he would never swap a seat with you because he's very, very superstitious, in that kind of old-fashioned way. Guys were always kind of saying; "oh, well, I'll take the early flight. I'll swap with you", and then of course the plane would crash.
I love the the simplicity of the guitar solo in 'Walking on Sunshine'; it's perfect for the song.
The daddle-addle-addle-a-dat-dat, that bit? [sings the riff at 2m 16s] Well, it's just a total rip off from [sings] "I need to love, love, to ease my mind" ['You Can't Hurry Love', by The Supremes]; that vibe, so it was just totally copied from that.
As I mentioned at the beginning, you've recently released a song and the video featuring your dog for 'I Couldn't Live Without Your Love'.
Look, who's a better star for a video? Who's better eye candy? You know, a 64 year old fat has-been, or a gorgeous little white poodle. I mean, I rest my case! And the song is very much about her. I mean, it's a gorgeous song, Tony Hatch and Jackie Trent wrote the song for Petula Clark back in the day, and I just absolutely love the song. It's so bright and feel-good and fun. It was so much fun to sing and do, and it took me probably two takes in the studio, and I was begging to do more because it's just so much fun to sing! When you get one of those songs, it's just glides off. It's so beautiful.
You must be looking forward to performing that live, if you haven't already.
Hello?! Give me a chance to learn the lyrics! I haven't performed it live yet. I mean, I don't know. My live set is kind of quite eclectic, because you go from some of the strange stuff I've written, from a song called 'Shut Your Mouth' and 'Crazy Mama', to 'Love Shine a Light' then 'Walking on Sunshine', then if I had, 'I Couldn't Live Without Your Love, well, why not? It'll probably happened this summer. Maybe not at the Rewind festivals, but at some point.
Is your time with The Waves behind you? Is that something in your past, or do you think you'll be getting back together at some point?
Well, we split up. I like to say The Waves crashed on the shore of life, and we did kind of separate in about 2000, so it's been a little while now that I've been with the new band. The guys were older than me, and I'm not sure if they still play, but I wouldn't say that a reunion is on the cards because we're not even really at the Christmas card stage. We just sort of parted ways, and that was it. It was really "move on".
What's coming up in your future?
Well, I've decided I'm just going to sporadically throw out singles from time to time, and I will continue on touring every weekend. Usually of a a summer there's plenty of work, and then of a winter I usually end up doing work in places like Australia and Dubai. So when I said about the song 'Walking on Sunshine' never going away, I meant it, because it seems like there's always room for it. People are always available to listen to it, and people are willing to book me on the strength of knowing that it's a song that's going to bring joy, bring people together, and make an occasion fun. It works really well for me because all I want to do, in the words of Cyndi Lauper, is have fun. You know, if it's not fun, I don't want to do it.
Katrina plays Rewind Scotland, Rewind North, and Rewind South this summer. For dates and info, visit the Rewind Festival site.
RSS Feed